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12-10-15 Traffic Cmt Minutes CITY OF SHOREWOOD 5755 COUNTRY CLUB RD TRAFFIC COMMITTEE MEETING SHOREWOOD CITY HALL TUESDAY,DECEMBER 10,2015 5:30 P.M. MINUTES COMMITTEE MEMBERS: FACILITATOR: David Cooley Sandy Finke Chuck Rickart,WSB Engineer Chris Gehrke Ed Hasek Teresa Elsbernd Ken Huskins CITY STAFF Bob Gagne Jeff Coplan Larry Brown,Public Works Director Paul Hornby, City Engineer ABSENT: OTHERS PRESENT: John Mohn Susanne Aspley Kris Sundberg,City Councilmember Kathy Curry Angela Nelson Rickart reviewed the meeting's agenda for the benefit of the committee members. He asked for comments about the evening's agenda. 1. APPROVE NOVEMBER 24,2015 MEETING MINUTES Cooley moved, Rickart seconded to approve the minutes as amended: Cooley asked for clarification of whether Lake Linden is included in the review. Rickart stated the need for the efficient use of roads will only increase with the new development of the Country Club Development: He stated only four roads have been chartered to be discussed as a result. He stated,additional roads could be added in the final report to the City Council. No amendmentswere made to the minutes following discussion noted above.Motion carried 8-0. 2. COUNTRY CLUB ROAD AT`SMITHTOWN ROAD CONCEPT REVIEW Rickart stated the concept is to limit traffic on County Rd 19. To prevent congestion at this intersection, trafie going east could do so while traffic to the north would enter into a traffic circle. As a review,,Smithtown:traffic would have access to Country Club Road and County Rd 19'. Rickart also reviewed traffic flow from other directions. Committee members discussed traffic flow patterns. Rickart stated one of the attributes of this is a roundabout. He stated a roundabout could require land acquisition in order for it to work. Three additional concepts were reviewed. Huskins reviewed the concept which included a mini and a full roundabout. Cooley noted the roundabout at the end of Country Club in the second and third options are the same. He asked what the radius is for them. Rickart stated a typical roundabout is 75 feet. Huskins reviewed the fourth concept. Cooley stated there are two lanes going east and two going north. He stated it would allow for drivers going north or south on 19 to not have to wait if they are turning right. It would illuminate some of the backup situations. He discussed problems TRAFFIC COMMITTEE MINUTES THURSDAY,DECEMBER 10,2015 PAGE 2 OF 4 B&J Automotive experiences with test drives. They suggested there not be a stop sign on Smithtown Road. Huskins asked for clarification of turn lanes. He asked if the intent is to have a southbound lane as well. Cooley agreed. Huskins asked if it would be possible to just have two lanes. Hasek stated he believed the neighborhood would not be happy about that. Hasek discussed his concerns about traffic flow in the morning and the inability to get onto Smithtown Road. Rickart explained how this should be corrected with this concept. Hasek stated if signage is the solution, then we only need to talk about signage. Elsbernd believed roundabouts correct many of these problems. She suggested a second traffic light so traffic is prevented from blocking the intersection. Rickart explained how such a light might coordinate with the existing light. Gehrke asked if traffic problems would be heightened with the addition of 140 new homes. Rickart stated there will be an impact from thatn but not all 140 homes would come through this intersection. Hasek asked for pros/cons for the concepts at this point. Coplan asked it there are other ways to influence driver's behavior through technology. Hasek stated there may be ways to influence'Google maps. Rickart stated he would talk to his IT staff. Coplan asked if Shorewood could encourage`Googly to suggest a preferred route. Hasek asked for comments on the concepts. Coplan stated he would advocate for roundabouts. Gehrke stated he would feel concepts one and two have high potential for backups. He thought there was potential for concept three as people could keep moving. He believed concept four was well thought,out and gave,people more access. He also believed the speed should be lowered to 25 miles,pgr hour. He stated his main concern is the light holds people back as it currently functions. He,discussed his concerns about Country Club Road being a cut through road to Highway 7. Gagne stated roundabouts were meant to keep traffic flowing. He believed the traffic will be a disaster for several months. He believed Country Club Road will have to be widened. He stated he preferred the concept with two roundabouts. Hasek stated a roundabout is a possibility. He encouraged members to go out on County Road 19 near Minnetonka Drive and near the bus garage to get an idea of the width of a widened Country Club Road. He believed faster traffic would be the result. He stated the fourth concept has possibilities but has issues. Cooley stated of the options,he preferred the third option, then the fourth option with a whole lot of signage. He liked the idea of having bike lanes on Country Club to slow down traffic. He stated there are so many conflicting agendas here (City, County) that make it all very difficult. He stated he did not support the first two options. He believed the benefit would be moving TRAFFIC COMMITTEE MINUTES THURSDAY,DECEMBER 10,2015 PAGE 3 OF 4 people and moving them safely. He stated we need to have ways people can move without using a car and make it safer. He believed pedestrians and bikers should be separated for safety reasons. Finke stated she didn't like the single roundabouts. Her first choice would be roundabouts at both intersections with two lanes. She liked the idea of having bike trails on Country Club with the addition of another stop sign at Yellowstone and Country Club to make it a 3-way stop. She believed concept four has merit but has many issues. Many of the same problems will remain with this concept. Elsbernd stated she was in favor of the dog bone plan with the two roundabouts. She believed a bike lane on Country Club Road should be added and have a separation of bikers and walkers. She was concerned about a comment about 19 being a County Road. She was concerned about the roundabout not ever being allowed because of this. Huskins stated he favored a roundabout over multiple lanes. He was unsure which design he would prefer at this point. He would like to consider,how to manage traffic that codes from 19 to stay on 19. Hasek suggested a separate pedestrian trail be located in the development with the bike trail not in the road on Country Club Road and,keep the road the way it is. Elsbernd stated thought will need to be given to how the bikers will get,to the trail safely. 3. YELLOWSTONE TRAIL/LAKE LINDEN DRIVE IDEAS/CONCEPT DISCUSSION a. 3-4 minutes per committee member b. Pros/cons of each idea/concept Huskins stated focus,should be on Yellowstone Trail and Country Club Road intersection and Yellowstone Trail and Lake Linden Drive. He asked for comments on improvements to those sections of the road. Elsbernd stated something needs to be done about Lake Linden because of sight line issues. She would like to see further study ofd secondary access point so there is another choice to get to Highway 7. She would also recommend a signal at its intersection with Highway 7. Elsbernd stated the curves'on Lake Linden cause problems, and she would like to see a more direct route. Finke stated she liked the idea of a second cut through. She suggested stop signs with the lights around them to make it clear drivers should stop. She believed the 3-way stop is good enough. Cooley believed additional signs could be added. He didn't like the curve on Lake Linden and the sight line to turn left into Cub. He suggested grade levels on the road might be an option. He didn't see a need to reconfigure the intersection at Yellowstone and Country Club. He stated sight lines aren't good all along there,but they should be slowing down traffic. Finke discussed the importance of having the trees cut back for safety reasons. TRAFFIC COMMITTEE MINUTES THURSDAY,DECEMBER 10,2015 PAGE 4 OF 4 Elsbernd stated Yellowstone east of Lake Linden does not have a shoulder, and this needs to be improved. Elsbernd departed the meeting. Hasek discussed grade and sight line issues along Yellowstone. He suggested leaving the road alone and putting in an off-street bike and pedestrian path. He would also like to see flashing stop signs if possible. He believed enforcement is the most important. Gagne stated his dream would be to have Country Club Road go straight to Highway 7. He stated signage is a simple fix, and he also recommended enforcement. Gehrke stated the easier we make it, the more vehicles that will cut through. He stated he doesn't like the blinking stop signs nor would"children at play" signage help. Coplan stated he advocated for flashing stop signs. He stated yellow signs that don't change their message eventually are not seen. He suggested some kind of message campaign and speed feedback. Huskins suggested a stop light be operational at Country Club Road and Yellowstone that would not be fully operational for the entire day. Another light couldbe,placed at Yellowstone and Lake Linden. Another idea at Lake Linden would be to make a portion of Lake Linden one way. Hasek explained how that would not be practical for all the truck traffic going to/from Cub. He stated if a one-way system could be developed that would not negatively impact the neighborhood, then that would be worth discussing. Coplan departed the meeting. Huskins stated the reality is enforcement has not been high on the priority list in Shorewood. He discussed the importance of including increased enforcement in our final report to the City Councit:, Committee members discussed enforcement. Huskins stated it may very well be that some of the improved roadway's would make enforcement easier. Gehrke departed the meeting. 4. NEXT MEETING The next meeting was,scheduled for January 7 at 5:30 p.m. Hasek discussed the importance of attendance and accountability. 5. ADJOURN The meeting adjourned at 7:25 p.m. RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED, Clare T.Link Recorder