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090689 PK MINCITY OF SHOREWOOD PARR COMMISSION MEETING WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 6, 1989 46 CALL TO ORDER M I N U T E S COUNCIL CHAMBERS 5755 COUNTRY CLUB ROAD 7:00 PM Chairman Laberee called the meeting to order at 7:11 PM. ROLL CALL Present: Chairman Laberee, Commissioners Wilson, Vogel, Christensen, Lindstrom, Andrus, and Weatherly (7:38 PM); Administrator Whittaker; Engineer Norton; and Council Liaison Gagne. Absent: Park Staff Rep Niccum APPROVAL OF MINUTES Wilson moved, Vogel seconded, to approve the minutes of Wednesday, September 6, 1989 with the following correction: Change spelling of Strote to Strot - page 1 Motion carried - 6/0. SILVERWOOD PARR QUESTIONNAIRE The residents were invited to present their input. ,inda Tilton The park dimensions should be stated, including a map with pertinent information zuAAOundi ztteets, divi/Sion names, poAk zize and topography. - The questionnaire should have a separate section where people can list up to their top 5 choices of activities they consider necessary for Silverwood Park. These items should also be prioritized, most important first, etc. - State that the land is acquired and paid for. - Provide information on the current neighborhood population and the pro- posed growth in the area and in the City. - She asked that while in the process of considering other parks the the area that people keep in mind the children in the area who are not old enough to drive or cross busy streets. - She said she drives by the park twice a day and it's unused. - She asked if the park is for deer or human beings, as right now there are no human beings using it. Julie Daugherty List restrooms as a facility. (Engineer Norton explained that water and sewer are available on site.) (Gagne mentioned that,at this time,all but one park are still using satellites.) Daugherty offered to distribute the questionnaire. (Chairman Laberee and Administrator Whittaker said they will discuss the process but the questionnaires will probably be mailed directly to the residents.; When the questionnaires are returned a public hearing will be held.) PARK COMMISSION MEETING WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 6, 1989 page 2 SILVERWOOD PARK QUESTIONNAIRE - continued *esident Comments Karen Heniff - Discuss how parks work; 7he,vc, design, Ainancing, maintenance and constAuction. (Gagne explained that the only funding at this time is from lot fees.) (Wilson explained the shortage of funds at this time. He also explained that the City does not have a Park Planner /Landscape Architect on staff at this time, but they are looking into the feasibility of retaining one on a consulting basis. The City is also discussing various ways of fund- ing all the parks.) - Heniff said the Sailor ran an article last week stating that Hennipen County Parks are 20% active /80% passive, and thats what she wants Shore- wood's parks to be. (Gagne said he was in favor of some development.a�s this w" p4tcchgz to be a a k, not a peed - She said it is important to focus on a "mission" statement - who will the park serve? She said she's concerned about the youth in the area. - She said the residents were .in-itiat2y Aeady to maize a quick dec iZion. Now She 6 eeU it is -i.mpott tant to tuhn to the peop' te. She appnee i,a teis the C.i ty' z 6 0 ttow -up and said it w" done with integt ty. Barbara Christensen of 19455 Ridge Road and Kathy and Gary Swanson, and Harold Ness who live directly adjacent to the east boundary of the park said they felt the park should be left as a wildlife area with the possibility of walking paths, and ask that this be one of the choices on the questionnaire. 0 arbara Christensen - Suggests locale, dimensions, space requirements, and cost of each facility be listed. - Mention other parks in the area, whats in them, and the distance from Silverwood Park. - Said she agrees with prioritizing up to 5 items in a separate area on the questionnaire. - City HalladdtLaZ should be on the back along with postage and a deadline so that they can be reversed, stapled, and returned to City Hall. - Said people presently cross - country ski, kids slide, and people show kids animals in the park. - Asked about funding for play area? (Was told action stopped because of questionnaire. Any contributions received specifically_ for Silverwood Park would be "earmarked" for Silverwood and be held to be used for the express purpose designated by contributes.) Gary Swanson - Said the existing map doesn't show trees, and he would like them shown. He would also like the map drawn to scale. - Said is important to have all development done at the same time, within a 1 -2 year period. Karen Heniff disagreed with Swanson, saying it is unrealistic to expect it to all be done at once, that doing it in stages is mote _&eat"..t c._ - Said there are no parks in the area with nature trails. -2- PARK COMMISSION MEETING WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 6, 1989 Page 3 SILVERWOOD PARK QUESTIONNAIRE - continued c ommissioner Lind6tAom informed Swanson that Shorewood has a 60 acre park- Freeman Park - that has approximately 20 acres of wooded preserve with wood - chip trails. ChvLatenzen a zo exptained the 50' night -off -way to Sitvek Laze and .6aid the Comm -zzion had dizc"Zed - putting in a dock and pozzibty a watkway thAough the marsh. Holly Jones - asked what would be in the cover letter and on the map? Chairman Laberee said that it hasn't been decided yet, the current map is very preliminary, it basically showed how items recommended in the comprehensive plan would fit in the park area. Harold Ness - Will everything be listed so the residents can decide? - Harold Ness and Linda Tilton requested listing and grouping items that can overlap or be combined (i.e. football /soccer, tennis courts /basketball courts, hockey /soccer, etc) - Will preliminary plan be open for review? (Chairman and Administrator said yes, and the residents will be notified when it is available.) - He pointed out that a neighborhood park is not for organized sports, that he has been involved in athletic activities in other parks such as Badger Park. (Badger Park is a neighborhood Park.) 1 6he Commission then began their discussion. The definition "pick -up ballfield" was discussed. Sugge6tionz inctuded: - unfinished ballfield - all -turf ballfield ( Laberee & Wilson felt this term signified a backstop) - sandlot - non - organized ballfield - area allocated for playing ball Commissioner Vogel brought up the fact that the Silverwood Park area is not a level piece of land, it's quite hilly and this results in the loss of a lot of space. Chairman Laberee thanked the residents for their input. He discussed the cover letter, saying it could outline current parks, the current budget, and the current Park Capital Improvement Fund. He also told residentsthat;a bond referendum, which would raise taxes to fund park improvement, is being considered. He discussed stages, saying that perhaps all the rough grading could be done at one time. He said he knows the park is small and the Commission will discuss multi -use. He explained that prioritizing up to 5 items would allow the Commission to narrow the list of options to be con - idered. He told the residents that the Commission would consider the phus- 0 eng this evening and get the questionnaire out as soon as possible. He also reminded the residents that the Park Commission is only an advisory body to the City Council and the final decision would be up to the Council. -3- PARR COMMISSION MINUTES WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 6, 1989 Page 4 SILVERWOOD PARK QUESTIONNAIRE - continued W ommissioner Weatherly volunteered to redo the questionnaire for Park Commission review. PARK CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT FUND STATUS No action was taken. The Commission needs an update on the P.C.I.F. and Freeman Park costs. FREEMAN PARR A. Field Depth - Letter to Engineer - Any Changes? B. Plans and Specs - Engineer Jim Norton Engineer Norton presented the preliminary plans and specs for the fencing of three softball field in Freeman park. He explained what has been done so far. He showed the Commission that the {pence was designed to protect open areas and prevent vehicle access. He showed the line fence4 25' 0� the base path. He said ASA (Amateur Softball Association) guidelines were used. He said he would be happy to answer any questions the Commission may have. The Commission discussed galvanized fencing vs. black vinyl fencing. George Haun said the fabric for black vinyl wasn't an issue, that the gates and posts raise costs, and this could mean a 30 % -70% cost increase over galvan- ized fencing. &aberee mentioned aesthetics, warranties, and breakdown. Haun said the vinyl doesn't fade but enachs under 40 to 50 degrees if hit. Noxton said he put green vinyl fencing in his yard 4 years ago and it is already peeling at the friction points. Haun said Becker Park in Crystal has vinyl fencing if anyone wants to check it out. The Commission discussed the black vinyl vs. galvanized with Engineer Norton and George Haun. They decided to get bids on both of them. The following decisions were made by the Park Commission. This is the information they want on the plans and specs to go out for bids: Backstops 16 feet high George Haun said fencing comes in 8' widths and -its but to avoid cutting and spti.c i,ng. Foul Line Fences Outfield Fences Gates Maintenance Gates 10 feet high /90 feet long 8 feet high All staggered 4 each field Backstop - 2 Outfield - 2 1 each field at end of 10' fence • South field West Field North Field 1st Base 3rd Base 1st Base -4- PARR COMMISSION MINUTES WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 6, 1989 Page 5 FREEMAN PARR &lans and Specs to go out for Bids Warning Track Each Field From infield around outfield before fences installed. Not to be included in the bid - Council to be asked to have Public Works install this. Top dressing a n( weed contr 1 ill be required annually. T w e eaieA to main t�ian gra�s�s unde�c t�eences. Estimate for - Warning Track on 3 fields at Freeman Park - by Don Zdrazil 630 Tons rock x $8.50 $5,355. Loader - 64 hrs x $45 2,880. Truck - 40 hrs x 16.90 676. Bobcat - 30 hrs x 26.45 793. $9,704. 3 operators x 65 hrs = 195 hrs x $14.77 2,880. Supervisor - 20 hrs x $22.39 44 7.80 3,327.80 Total Estimate $13,031.80 Chain and Post Fencin Have Public Works install around Northwest parking lot and 30' along Railroad /Park boundary where vehicles could enter park. Post sign "No Motorized Vehicles ". Fence Field Depth 285' on all fields Other important issues regarding fencing - Anchor fabric every 80" for proper tension - bending wire ties - no sharp points - use spec ia2 botts Aso they can't be removed - plumb and level the gates - knuckle - knuckle the top o6 the hence. - wse top ban - tension wire on bottom - 6 gauge backstop - 9 gauge line fences - concrete footings -36" deep /tine 6encez and 4 8 "deep backstop (do not cuse vase shape) The Commission wishes the Council to be aware that the above specifications were chosen to provide the safest conditions possible thus avoiding the possibility of lawsuits and and providing player and spectatot protection. Andrus moved, Weatherly seconded, to recommend to Council that they include a warning track, and that they direct Public Works Director Zdrazil to prepare the warning track before the fence is put in. Motion carried - 7/0. -5- PARR COMMISSION MINUTES WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 6, 1989 Page 6 REEMAN PARR - continued Administrator Whittaker pointed out to the Commission that if Public Works Director Zdrazil has to do the warning track and the fencing around the parking lot and along the Railroad line, the building of a new hockey rink in Cathcart Park may have to be postponed until next year. He said the rink would be repaired. The rock on the Railroad Corridor was mentioned. Many compliments have been received. Regrading of the North Field The Commission discussed the regrading of the North field. Engineer Norton said Phil Tipka has staked out the field to cut the right field and to level the center left field. Haun highly recommends cutting the right field 12' -18' and level the left field over the center field. Norton said Haun has sample specs that he will use. Washout on North Field Haun pointed out that there the parking area, he said a C. Irrigation - George Haun is quite a washout on the north diamond from slight berm is needed when the field is regraded. Haun said he'd talked to Laberee and Sue. He said an ideal time to irrigate � ould be before the fences go in. He thinks the City will want irrigation o avoid losing the turf. He said you can see bad grass when irrigation is not available. Haun said Toro had done a lot of work for him so they worked up the plans and specs for all fields (3 softball and football) at no cost. He said he doesn't think it is necessary for the Engineer to spec this. He said it's not necessary to use Toro but they put in the best product. He said it is a very detailed plan with recessed heads. He estimated the cost at $34,000- 38,000, and said this is not a bad price for quality. He said if galvanized fencing is used the amount saved would be almost enough to do two ballfields. Gagne asked if they were automatic. Haun said yes. It was said that the pressure at the hydrant is 65 PSI so a booster would be needed to do the far fields. Haun said he would leave the plans with the City. Laberee asked about maintenance, blowing out the heads? Haun said you blow them out with a compressor - he said the first year the contractor will show the City how. He said the whole are could be watered in 4 hours. The watering could start at 3:00 AM. Laberee said more details are needed on back filling and compacting. Haun agreed. Laberee asked Gagne when it should be presented to Council? Gagne said he would inform the Council. Goalposts Christensen said he talked to Tom Bartsh about the football fields and the football Association will pay for the goalposts. Haun said Public Works could make the goalposts using 23- outside diameter pipe and incorporate a occer net. Sue is to call Christensen with a price. The Commission xplained the criss -cross configuration of the football /soccer field to Haun. Haun then said portable soccer goals are easy to get but they need to be anchored. I am PARK COMMISSION MINUTES WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 6, 1989 Page 7 � AN PARR EM Gagne said he felt the football /soccer would need irrigation if it was going to be used for both activities. GEORGE HAUN Chairman Laberee thanked Haun for all the work he has done, especially the irrigation. Haun thanked the Commission. He said it has been enjoyable working with them. He said Don Zdrazil and his people are excellent. Haun said he will review the specs for the fences. Whittaker said Haun will be used for 9 - 10 hours to oversee installation. Haun left at 10:02 PM. REPORTS Council Liaison Gagne reported on the following items: Manor Park Warming House Council approved a temporary trailor for 1 year. Joint Meeting - Park /Planning The Planning Commission wants to meet with the Park Commission in October. Sue is to ask Brad to schedule the meeting for October 4 or October 18. MATTERS FROM THE FLOOR Football Christensen said the Football Association wants to start on Saturday. They have their insurance. They need a key. General Discussion P.C.I.F. Administrator Whittaker said the fund would probably be at least $10,000 short with the fences. Silverwood Park Questionnaire The Commission asked that Administrator do the cover letter. Commission agreed to drop the regulation softball field. They will add "all -turf sports field". Manor Warming House /Trailer Gagne asked that Sue line up the trailer, light over the pond, and what ever else is needed. Waterford Third Additon and Highway 7 Intersection Gagne explained that there is a public hearing at the Minnewashta School on September 12 if anyone is interested in attending. Liaison needed Christensen, the September Liaison, said he will be out of town and asked for a replacement. Andrus volunteered. ADJOURNMENT Lindstrom moved, Weatherly seconded, to adjourn at 10:32 PM. Motion carried unanimously. RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED FROM NOTES - Sue Niccum Page 7