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081297 PK MINCITY OF SHOREWOOD COUNCIL CHAMBERS PARK COMMISSION MEETING 5755 COUNTRY CLUB ROAD TUESDAY, AUGUST 12, 1997 7:30 P.M. MINUTES 1. CALL TO ORDER Chair Colopoulos called the meeting to order at 7:30 p.m. 2. ROLL CALL Present: Chair Colopoulos; Commissioners Puzak, Dallman, Arnst, Packard, and Wilson; Council Liaison McCarty; Engineer Larry Brown, Planning Director Brad Nielsen, Park Planner Mark Koegler and Administrator Jim Hurm. Absent: Commissioner Bensman 3. REVIEW AGENDA The consensus of the Commission was to reorganize the agenda to ensure consideration and discussion relative to the Shorewood Senior Housing Project as well as the 1998 Park Budget. 4. APPROVAL OF MINUTES JUNE 24, 1997 Wilson moved, Arnst seconded, to approve the minutes as amended on Page 1, Item 6A, Sentence 5, change to reflect, "Commissioner Puzak recommended that the City replace the signage with a city sign, utilizing its own wording.." Motion passed 6/0. JULY 9, 1997 Arnst moved, Packard seconded, to approve the minutes as submitted. Motion passed 6/0. 5. MATTERS FROM THE FLOOR - None 6. DISCUSSION OF SHOREWOOD SENIOR HOUSING DEVELOPMENT (EAGLECREST) PROPOSAL City Planner Nielsen noted in walking the site there are a number of individual trees which may lend themselves to relocation. Commissioner Dallman noted there had been discussions relative to moving units 45 through 48 in an effort to avoid a cluster of willow trees. He asked if shifting or eliminating the buildings would be necessary to save a cluster of willows. Nielsen stated the developer is giving consideration to shifting some of the buildings. He stated the age and the value of the trees will be taken into consideration. PARK COMMISSION MINUTES AUGUST 12, 1997 - PAGE 2 Commission Dallman stated he would support the land swap which is proposed by the developer. He would not want to see a unit in the development lost in an effort to save one of the willows since the loss of one building would also result in a reduction of tax revenue. Commissioner Dallman felt there may be space sufficient for an additional ballpark on the land to be swapped. Commissioner Arnst inquired relative to the parking spaces which will be lost and whether there is room to mitigate for them on this particular piece of property which will be gained through the land swap. Nielsen stated parking arrangements have not been laid out. There have been some discussions relative to expanding the southerly parking lot which would result in the addition of approximately 15 to 20 spaces. Commissioner Arnst stated her concern is not for the loss of trees, but rather mitigation of the parking and if it cannot be accommodated in the upper area, could it be accommodated in the space of units 18, 19, and 20. Nielsen was unsure how many cars could be accommodated in the space of units 17, 18 and 19. Hurm commented the area north of where the street will come in where the current parking lot is located for Field No. 1 is estimated to be approximately 100 feet. This would be sufficient area for three rows of parking. Commissioner Arnst asked if units 18, 19 and 20 were moved, could the berm be brought around to the back of units 16 and 17. Nielsen stated it would be desirable to screen the parking from those units. Commissioner Puzak stated it would further encroach into the parking lot, but it would be the appropriate thing to do. Relative to trails, Commissioner Packard felt the road comes very close to wetland and questioned whether there is sufficient room to put a trail in that area. Nielsen explained if the concept plan is approved, the development stage plans would include a wetland delineation. There is a 35 -foot buffer requirement from the wetland. The wetland ordinance does allow some encroachment into the buffer area with, in some cases, roads or driveways. Nielsen stated a trail would be a reasonable use of the buffer area. Commissioner Packard asked if it is anticipated the trail would go around the wetland or just along the southerly side. Nielsen stated typically it would be expected the developer would put in the segment relative to the development itself. If the City wants to tie onto that trail, that would be at City expense. Nielsen pointed out relative to park dedication that on this particular project it is based on the development potential under the current zoning. Park dedication for the development is estimated to be approximately $22,000. Hurm commented the Park Commission would need to decide whether these funds should be rolled into park improvements which relate to this park. Commissioner Dallman noted there had been a reference to acquiring additional right -of -way on Eureka Road and asked if that would lend itself to the developer building a trail along Eureka Road between the development and the road which would tie into the trail system. Nielsen stated this has not been discussed, however, it could be incorporated into the plans. He was unaware of any discussions relative to extending a trail along Eureka Road. PARK COMMISSION MINUTES AUGUST 12, 1997 - PAGE 3 Commissioner Puzak felt this would give units 5,6,7 and 8 access to the trail around their wetlands. Commissioner Dallman stated he would also like to see a trail along the west side of the wetland. Nielsen pointed out it may be preferable to have the trail closer to the fences and farther away from vehicular traffic. It was the consensus of the Commission that the initial swap was good. PARK COMMISSION MINUTES AUGUST 12, 1997 - PAGE 4 Commission Wilson felt it would be wisest to place the parking at the south end. He noted that was not why other parties were interested in that swap. It was initially discussed it would be favorable to gain land on that end to reconfigure ball fields and possibly add a ball field. Commissioner Arnst questioned how another field could be added without additional parking. Commissioner Wilson felt if the goal of the land swap is to provide additional parking, it would make more sense to design additional parking to the south end. With the entrance closed, this would allow for additional parking. Commissioner Dallman felt tennis courts could be added to this area as well. He felt if it comes to the point where one unit has to be removed from the system, it would make more sense to place it in this area than to lose the tax revenue. However, if a unit will not be lost, then the south piece could be retained for a tennis court as well as additional parking. Nielsen stated the developer is going to look at doing some shifting. He is aware of the suggestion that one particular unit be moved down farther. Commissioner Wilson felt tree preservation may have gone to extremes and stated it needs to be sensible. He pointed out many of the trees should be saved, however, the brush could be removed. Council Liaison McCarty pointed out tree preservation is a policy and not an ordinance. Chair Colopoulos presumes the City has been more involved in the design of this project and shepherding this project through the consideration of various sites that it would have been in the instance of a private property owner selling to a developer for general development. Nielsen stated this is true. He explained the City did a site selection survey relative to senior housing. Out of 35 sites, this particular location was at least in the top three, if not the most favorable site. Several of the reasons for the high ranking is the fact that it is available, undeveloped, and the proximity to single family residential. Water was also a consideration. Chair Colopoulos stated senior housing is considered to be a public project interest from the City's perspective. Nielsen explained it is an established goal under the Comprehensive Plan. Chair Colopoulos remarked he is in favor of senior housing. He noted that with this development, the last adjacent land expansion for Freeman Park is gone and there are no other alternatives available. Council Liaison McCarty stated the policy of the City is to not acquire any additional park land. Chair Colopoulos inquired as to the market value the developer paid for the property. He wanted it to be clear that this is an irrevocable step that is being taken. Regardless of the policy now or in the future, the land will be gone and the park will not physically be capable of being expanded in this area. Chair Colopoulos noted the developer paid $720,000 for this property which is considerably more than would be available in the Park budget. It was also noted this is not land which could be held in abeyance and undeveloped for an extended period of time. In terms of selecting a neighbor for the park, there are opportunities available given the City's involvement in the planning process which would not be available under other certain circumstances. PARK COMMISSION MINUTES AUGUST 12, 1997 - PAGE 5 Commissioner Puzak stated given the two goals to acquire senior housing or purchasing additional park land, it has been the express desire of the City Council that senior housing is needed. He noted there is an amount of acreage in Freeman Park which is undeveloped and at this point, the City needs senior housing more than it needs additional park land. PARK COMMISSION MINUTES AUGUST 12, 1997 - PAGE 6 Commissioner Dallman stated if the Osha property could possibly become park property in the future, it would not make sense to give away the south portion of the property. Chair Colopoulos stated that to be true, however, the Oshas have not been approached nor volunteered to sell the property. Engineer Brown commented that even if some area is gained in a land swap, the area that has been taken into consideration on south side of TH 7 was originally a parking lot. Returning this area to a parking lot would not take as great an effort as what he would envision in the north end. Clearing of trees and soil conditions are items which would have to be taken into consideration. It was agreed if the Osha property was ever feasible, the second proposed land swap would not be a good idea. Commissioner Puzak asked if that situation would be in the realm of possibility in the next ten years. Hurm reminded the policy as set out in the Comprehensive Plan is to not acquire additional park land. It was the consensus of the Park Commission to withdraw the second land swap. Commissioner Arnst felt the Council is asking the Commission to make recommendations on land swap one. Nielsen reviewed the recommendations made. (1) closing the southerly access to the park; (2) trail system ties into Freeman Park; (3) relative to the actual land swap itself, what the developer suggested would be agreeable and some use could be made of the southerly portion; (4) screening and landscaping along the back side of the units. Chair Colopoulos felt the recommendation should hinge on things such as berm, fence, and covenants mentioning the proximity to the park. Commissioner Puzak felt as the swap is negotiated, it should be negotiated or encouraged that as street traffic is allowed to come through the park, the City would like the developer to provide for the development of a trail on the west side of Eureka from TH 7 to the Freeman Park entrance or at least tie into wetlands that comes into Freeman Park. Commissioner Puzak summarized the Commission likes the four recommendations which were proposed and would add the trail which would take some of the foot traffic off of the road and also allow the senior citizens access to the park. This would provide additional walking area. Hurm asked if the Commission would want to attempt to obtain another six feet along the park road for a trail. Nielsen did not feel this would be possible. Commissioner Puzak expressed concern with street traffic through Freeman Park. The road is extremely narrow and will now have a berm on one side and a fence on the other side as well as children walking out to the parking lot. He noted this speaks to the need for more width, however, there is no place to obtain it. Nielsen stated he would not be in favor of having a second exit from the park giving the amount of activity which occurs. Brown stated there may also be additional amounts of emergency vehicles which service the development. Nielsen stated for concept stage purposes, the Commission may want to look at what options are available to create pedestrian access between the property and the park. PARK COMMISSION MINUTES AUGUST 12, 1997 - PAGE 7 Commissioner Puzak pointed out there is currently a substandard driveway through the park. If a new public street is allowed to tie into that substandard driveway, he inquired whether there will be pressure to upgrade the driveway to a road. Nielsen noted there is not sufficient room to do that and there is no good purpose to go through there other than park traffic coming and going. Commissioner Puzak expressed concern relative to the needs of the fire department. Nielsen stated the fire marshall has already reviewed the plans and he is satisfied with the circulation. It has been recommended that the internal system be widened somewhat. Dallman moved, Puzak seconded approving the land swap; requesting the developer to tie into the development contract that a trail be built along the west side of Eureka Road from the public road to the Freeman Park entrance; that a trail be built along the south side of wetlands area and be tied into the Freeman Park system; subject to the recommendations of staff for a berm and fence to be built along outlot B to establish a buffer between the park and the development; and that the public road connect to the park and tie into the existing park road. Motion passed 6/0. 7. DISCUSSION OF PARK AND TRAIL PLANNING WITH MARK KOEGLER Mark Koegler, Hoisington Koegler Group, met with the Commission to discuss park and trail planning. Chair Colopoulos commented on Mr. Koegler's memorandum of August 6, 1997, and pointed out that while there is strong support for a trail system, there is also strong opposition to the trail system. Mr. Koegler noted he was responding to the numbers of the survey. He stated there are certain aspects of the trail plan which will need to be updated. He suggested the Commission review the trail system to assure what is being looked at represents the minimum necessary to effectively link all areas of the community which the Commission wants to be linked. Mr. Koegler stated at this point, he would like to build a common level of expectations and put together a scope of services. Chair Colopoulos felt the best place to start may be to identify the segments of the trail plan relative to their value to the community and from where their base of support is derived. He noted there are some elements which are recreation and others which relate to access and safety. Chair Colopoulos explained a trail system is a conglomeration of many different segments for different purposes. Chair Colopoulos noted many residents are opposed to the trail system because they see it as a plan to place sidewalks throughout the city. Mr. Koegler stated this is a misconception which needs to be addressed. Commissioner Puzak felt the Commission needs to further focus the vision in the mission statement which was written approximately a year ago. He stated he would like to take the discussion of a designated trail system and add some structure to it. Commissioner Puzak suggested on those roads designated feeder roads, the Commission propose a 6 -foot wide bituminous trail. Those trails interconnecting small communities, going through parks, to wetlands or into scenic areas would be chip bark. The major thoroughfares within the city, such as Smithtown, might be off street, protected by curb, gutter and buffer. PARK COMMISSION MINUTES AUGUST 12, 1997 - PAGE 8 PARK COMMISSION MINUTES AUGUST 12, 1997 - PAGE 9 Commissioner Puzak felt if the Commission agreed this was the direction the Commission is going, this could be communicated to the citizens. Mr. Koegler stated the message needs to read clearly in the plan and there may need to be some changes made to achieve this. Commissioner Puzak stated the Commission needs to do a better job communicating their vision. Mr. Koegler commented as the trail issue is addressed, there will need to be some flexibility to allow issues which might arise to be addressed. He questioned the necessity for another survey given the fact there is data which is less than a year old. He also questioned if another survey is anticipated, if trails would be the only issue addressed or whether other issues such as tennis courts would be included. Chair Colopoulos felt it necessary to segregate the trail plan from other in -park issues which preclude the need for a further survey. He felt the Commission may want to poll through the final communication plan what the Commission is contemplating. Council Liaison McCarty pointed out there is some desire on the Council for scientific data and as many respondents as possible on a survey of this nature prior to proceeding. Commission Puzak suggested the Park Commission develop a vision and then publish two versions of that vision. A survey could then be done asking which of the ideas is best. He felt this progress would begin immediately, communicating and educating would begin and capital dollars would not be spent without obtaining good feedback from the citizens. Commissioner Arnst noted her understanding the Commission is going to move ahead with this plan and the options will be set forth. She questioned whether there would be an option set forth which would provide for no trails at all. Commissioner Puzak felt that option would have to be presented. Commissioner Wilson stated he is in favor of the plan as set out in Mr. Koegler's August 6 memorandum. He stated he would not want to have the funds spent on this every year without implementing a plan. Commissioner Arnst asked why the Park Commission did not do anything when this plan was first completed six years ago. Council Liaison McCarty stated there were public meetings as well a funds set aside. She explained much of the system was planned for future years. Commissioner Wilson questioned at the time the Concept Plan was completed, how much money was available to spend on trails. Hurm stated there had been no funds set aside at that time. Chair Colopoulos stated he was more enthusiastic about the trail project before he began understanding there are certain procedures or processes in place which were not agreeable to various members of the Council. He stated the Park Commission needs a charge to go forward with this plan and to bring the vision to the citizens. Commissioner Puzak stated the Commission must be sure this issue is not approached in a forceful manner or in such a way as to suggest a final decision has been made. PARK COMMISSION MINUTES AUGUST 12, 1997 - PAGE 10 Commissioner Arnst stated the City Council charged the Park Commission with reviewing the trail plan and she would like some reassurance or acknowledgment of what has been done. PARK COMMISSION MINUTES AUGUST 12, 1997 - PAGE 11 Chair Colopoulos remarked he would like to see a removal of the presumption that the Commission will come to the public assuming this is a done deal. Hurm suggested keeping in mind that this is a process and a plan and it will be several years before the first implementation occurs. At that point, the Commission could hold discussions with the affected neighborhood to work out the details. Chair Colopoulos did not feel it would be reasonable to expect a 100 percent response survey. He did not feel that would be necessary to arrive at a statistically valid sample of public opinion. Mr. Koegler felt there to be a certain amount of political resolve necessary in this situation and suggested it would be important to integrate the Council early on. Mr. Koegler suggested the Council be brought into a work session with the Park Commission when discussions are held relative to the vision statement. Chair Colopoulos felt the Commission to be looking for reassurance from Council that no one would be sabotaging any outcome but the one which would provide for no trail. Council Liaison McCarty was hopeful if a process is followed, it will be respected. Mr. Koegler stated he will compile the background material on the plans which currently exist and requested time on an agenda to go through that information, review what was done, bring it up to date and set some direction at that meeting. In addition, he will refine the information into a more detailed work program. Mr. Koegler suggested the Council be integrated early on to assure the Commission is not going in a different direction than the Council would like to see. Mr. Koegler will be added to the September 9, 1997, agenda. Commissioner Packard was very satisfied with Mr. Koegler's memorandum. 8. DISCUSSION WITH SOCCER LEAGUE - FREEMAN PARK FIELDS #1 AND #2 REMODEL Mike Moore and Missy Carbonneau, Tonka United Soccer, were in attendance. Chair Colopoulos noted previous discussions had been held relative to resting certain field space, renovating the space and allowing time for it to recover. He asked for Mr. Moore and Ms. Carbonneau's input to determine which segments will be addressed first. Ms. Carbonneau stated if a third is taken out each year, there will be periods of time in which two - thirds of the fields are not useable. Ms. Carbonneau asked if the Commission would consider every other year as opposed to every year. Commissioner Dallman stated one -third per year had been discussed. Brown stated at this time there are no provisions for maintaining the fields. Mr. Moore requested not more than one -third of the fields be taken out of commission at one time. Chair Colopoulos pointed out the amount of space must be worth doing incrementally, but he would like to have the league determine what would be acceptable. PARK COMMISSION MINUTES AUGUST 12, 1997 - PAGE 12 Hurm pointed out the City did rest a number of the fields this year. Ms. Carbonneau stated smaller kids were put on some of the fields giving them a partial rest. In addition, she will be looking at other alternatives to relieve parking issues. Commissioner Puzak stated the two goals to be to allow the City time to rest the fields to make them pleasant and safe and to work with the users to be sure they will be able to accommodate their schedules. Hurm ask whether or not the Board will support the City's program of requesting funds be donated for maintenance of Freeman Park. Mr. Moore assured the Association is willing to make the donations. Ms. Carbonneau noted there is a Soccer 6 tournament Labor Day Weekend and asked whether the fields would be off line prior to this tournament. Brown stated there are no plans at the moment to address that particular field, however, it could be made a priority. Chair Colopoulos noted some field painting has ended up on the bituminous path in the park. He suggested additional adult supervision. Ms. Carbonneau stated she will address this matter. Chair Colopoulos recessed the meeting at 9:30 p.m. and reconvened at 9:35 p.m. 9. 1998 PARK BUDGET REVIEW Chair Colopoulos noted the balance of the trail fund to be $106,826 and the total park fund to consist of $124,318. Hurm explained they are separate funds, one for trails and the other covers everything else. He noted the funds are not interchangeable without Council approval. Commissioner Packard questioned where the expense for Mark Koegler would be addressed. Hurm suggested splitting the expense into two categories, parks and trails. There was $1,500 budgeted this year and $6,000 for 1998. Commissioner Dallman reported the Park Foundation discussed the concession and the consensus of the Foundation was that a $50,000 building is quite low and they felt the Park Commission should be willing to spend money to get conceptual drawings and /or a cost estimate completed. Chair Colopoulos felt rather than arbitrarily increasing the budget, there would be a need to investigate this to determine a figure. Hurm suggested the Commission or possibly a committee take the time to tour several buildings in Chaska. Perhaps a building would not have to be designed if one of the buildings toured were to be of interest. Commissioner Dallman pointed out this item will have to be budgeted for in 1998 and suggested a line item be added to the budget. Hurm stated the Commission could go back to the Foundation and ask that the profits from the concession stand be used for this purpose. Another alterative would be to allocate $3,000 for the plans or utilize, with Council approval, part of the $50,000 which has been set aside for this project. PARK COMMISSION MINUTES AUGUST 12, 1997 - PAGE 13 Chair Colopoulos felt a footnote should be added to the effect that $3,000 of the funds set aside for this project would be used for the study. Hurm stated under the Park Project Schedule, a sentence will be added with an asterisk under 'Building North - Loan $50,000, approximately $3,000 may be spent in 1998 on a building plan." PARK COMMISSION MINUTES AUGUST 12, 1997 - PAGE 14 It was agreed the task force would be removed from the objectives since the task force was to be completed in 1997. Commissioner Puzak noted some funding along Smithtown and noted the land was acquired and questioned whether it would be developed in 1998. Brown and Hurm were unsure of the status of this matter and Hurm will further investigate. Commissioner Puzak recalled the Park Commission had asked Council to negotiate with the developer to provide some land in lieu of their $1,000 per lot fee. Hurm stated it was not in lieu of the lot fees. Commissioner Puzak recalled the land had been negotiated for with the intent that a bird watch bench would be placed there. He felt this should be completed in 1998 since the developer will be out of the development in 1999. Puzak moved, Dallman seconded submitting the 1998 Park Budget to City Council as amended. Motion passed 510. It was noted this motion would include the five year Capital Improvement Plan. Dallman moved, Puzak seconded tabling the remainder of the agenda to the September 9, 1997, meeting of the Park Commission. Motion passed 510. Commissioner Arnst requested a final report relative to the concession stand and Park Foundation Report be included on the September 9, 1997, agenda. It was also recommended the concession stand issue be placed on the first agenda in January, 1998. 10. REPORTS - Tabled PARK "TO DO" UPDATE 11. RECONSIDERATION FOR SEPARATION OF OFF - STREET TRAIL FROM COVINGTON ROAD - Tabled 12. DISCUSSION OF LIQUOR USE AT FREEMAN PARK - Tabled 13. DISCUSSION OF CHANGING FREEMAN PARK SIGN ( "CITY PARK" TO "FREEMAN PARK ") - Tabled 14. ELECTION OF LIAISON TO PARK FOUNDATION (TO REPLACE SANDRA TRETTEL) - Tabled 15. REVIEW DEEPHAVEN PARK BOOKLET - Tabled 16. NEW BUSINESS - Tabled 17. OLD BUSINESS - Tabled 18. ADJOURNMENT Puzak moved, Wilson seconded adjourning the meeting at 10:13 p.m. Motion passed 6/0. PARK COMMISSION MINUTES AUGUST 12, 1997 - PAGE 15 RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED Cheryl Wallat Recording Secretary TimeSaver Off Site Secretarial